Source: 24/02/2022. Очевидцы / 06.11.2024 https://ochevidcy.com/anna-chagina-mne-bylo-strashno-pet-solnechnyj-krug/
Anna Chagina is a viola player from Tomsk. After the Russian invasion of Ukraine, she took part in an anti-war rally, went to pickets, and wrote anti-war posts on social networks. She first got an administrative case, then a criminal case under the article on "discrediting the armed forces of the Russian Federation". When they came to search her, she sang to those who searched her.
Left the country. Now lives in Vilnius. Plays "jams" with musicians from different countries.
Tell us about yourself.
— My name is Anna, I am from Tomsk, I am 44 years old. I have been involved in music most of my life, I am a Christian, I have two adult children — a daughter and a son. Now I live in Vilnius, trying to rebuild my life.
How long have you been making music and what kind of music do you like?
— My first education was in cultural studies, but then I decided that I wanted to do something more practical, to realize myself more in art, so I went to study at a music college. I graduated from college with a degree in viola, and that was the beginning of my musical career. I worked at the philharmonic, then I started teaching violin and played in different musical groups. I have a great passion for Irish music, punk rock, I really love Bach.
Tell me how you, a “middle-aged woman,” could “discredit the army,” twice?
— I want to say “easily,” but this is, in general, a bitter joke. Indeed, a middle-aged woman can become a threat to the Russian army, to its honor and dignity. This is not a very pleasant experience.
Why did you attend the anti-war rally in Tomsk?
— I read about the war starting in the morning, still lying down, but it seemed to me that I fell. It was a shock, because I am not the kind of person who follows the news. Then my friends and I actively discussed it for several days, worried, and eventually began to go out on solo pickets. My daughter went out on a solo picket and was detained that same day. After the detention, she told me what happened at the police station, how they talked to her, how she behaved. Then they passed the law on defamation, and later there was a rally. It was scary, but we went. It was very disturbing, but sitting at home is even harder, as is doing nothing at all. A rally is at least something that can be done. I did not go out on a solo picket because I was scared. At the rally, I was detained along with several people almost immediately. My closest people were nearby, so first they took my friend's daughter, then her husband, then I took her poster and went with it until they detained me. I had a conversation with an FSB officer, after which they put me on notice and started following me. It was March. I asked people to help me pay the fine, and in three days we collected money through VKontakte for my fine and for the fine of another girl I knew. My friends immediately started telling me that I needed to leave, that they wouldn't let it go, that it would only get worse. Honestly, I didn't believe that it would get worse for me personally, but I was very afraid for my friends and loved ones. I wasn't a member of any political organizations, I rarely actively expressed my civic position, so I wasn't particularly worried about myself. When all this started happening to me - surveillance, trolling on the Internet - I treated it as something that wasn't very real. It was, of course, stressful, but at the same time, comparing it to what happened during the war, I thought that these were small difficulties.
You were charged with a second "discrediting of the Russian army" for quoting philosopher Nikolai Karpitsky on VKontakte. Tell us what the discrediting actually consisted of?
— Nikolai Karpitsky is my friend’s teacher, who influenced me greatly. This is my childhood and youth, I was 16 then, I had just started going to church. My friend told me about his teacher, about his anti-fascist initiatives, about how deeply he was immersed in the study of religious medieval mysticism — that’s how I learned about Karpitsky. I knew that Karpitsky lived in Slavyansk, so when the war began, I started asking my friends what was wrong with him, how he was feeling now, what he was doing, and I started reading his posts on Facebook and Telegram. It turned out that the man had not changed at all and remained a deep thinker. He reflected on the topic of war, spoke in detail about what was happening in Slavyansk, what was happening in other regions of Ukraine. I wanted to share this with people. The posts I published on my site were without links to his channel, but they were his words, and they were primarily addressed to thinking Russians. They were philosophical reflections on the topic of, for example, whether Russian soldiers are orcs or not, how war is possible in the 21st century, what Russia is now, what necro-imperialism is. Karpitsky continues to publish his thoughts, and I continue to read them. At first, when the war had just begun, he personally helped me a lot, because the media gave a very emotional assessment. I still can’t listen to news about the war, because for me, as a musician, everything that comes through my ears is too traumatic. Now I only read. And Karpitsky had a view that seemed very sober to me, without exaggeration. When there was a nightmare everywhere, I wanted some kind of living testimony. I don’t remember how many of his posts I published, but that was after the arrest. I understood that there might be some liability, but, based on the constitution, I should not have been subject to criminal prosecution because I only had one administrative case. I thought that I had one administrative case, there would be another, but as long as it was tolerable, I was ready to go along with it. When they came to search my place, I told them about it, that they were breaking the law, that they had no right to arrest me and conduct a search because I only had one administrative case. They told me: "No, this is a special article."
Tell us how the search went.
— The investigator who came to me immediately said that the entire Soviet police department knew me, without specifying why. It was unpleasant, but at the same time, I would say, very gentle. When I told one person about this, I said: “They didn’t beat me during the arrest — that’s already good,” because I read that in other cities they beat you, regardless of who you are — a woman, a man, an elderly person, a young person, they just beat you and that’s it. We didn’t have that in Tomsk. Then there were similar cases when security forces beat someone, but it didn’t affect me. I asked them to carefully put things back in their place. Probably, everyone who came didn’t expect to see what they saw — my family, we were alone with my daughter, our surroundings, me. We were all in mutual shock. The special forces officer generally hid in a corner and sat on a chair for the entire search, looking at his smartphone. And I organized a concert for the FSB officers.
How did those who searched your home react to your music?
— The best song was “Bright Star” — it’s a Baptist song. We sang it with the children in elementary school, it’s dedicated to Christmas. When I sang it, there was a ringing silence. That is, someone continued doing something, but basically everyone just stood and listened. It was a contrast. Music, of course, helped me get through it. My daughter also tried to sing, but her voice immediately gave out, because, as it turned out later, she was starting to get pneumonia, at that time she only had a fever. I sang, then she sang, then she said she couldn’t anymore, and I started singing again. Then it dawned on me that in total I sang different songs for two hours. The FSB officers gave different comments: “The song is too short”, “Let’s do something modern”, or “You’re not singing a patriotic repertoire”. Then I sang “Kalinka-Malinka” for them. In general, it was interesting. But "Sunny Circle, Sky Around" was already scary for me to sing, so I don't remember whether I sang it or not. I think that song was already considered extremist by then.
Can I ask you to sing a verse from "Bright Star"?
A bright star is shining in the sky.
Mom says to the children by the Christmas tree:
Soon, soon, New Year,
Soon, soon, Christmas,
The celebration is coming.
There is also a repeat of the chorus and there are lines like: "Happy holiday, happy holiday to the grown-up kids, even the pranksters say this." It's a good song, my children and I really loved singing it.
When a criminal case was opened against you, were you afraid of going to jail?
— Yes. But Russian reality has taught me that everything is possible, and prison is not the worst option. Well, you’ll sit in prison, but at least you’ll have a stable breakfast-lunch-dinner, you don’t have to think about anything. In general, these terrible, nightmarish thoughts come to me even here, when I’m safe. Sometimes I think that I left my family, left the country and went away, unlike Navalny, and it would be better to sit in prison. And then I remember those who would not have gone to prison, who would have been forced to come to me, who would bring me parcels, who would worry about me, that I’m not doing well there. I understand that this is an endless lie and humiliation in which you’re used to living, in which you’re used to thinking that prison is a way out. In reality, prison is not a way out. But I was mentally prepared for it. That night I spent in prison showed that I would survive there.
At the trial you said that you are a convinced pacifist. When did you realize this and how did it manifest itself?
— When did I first think about it? After or during the trial, I remembered that I cried to the song “Sunny Circle” as a child. It was just an emotional reaction. Here is the Soviet children’s song “Sunny Circle, the sky around,” and Anya is crying. It was absolutely impossible to sing it along because my voice was shaking. Well, I guess that’s when I realized it.
How did you end up in Vilnius?
— They tried to persuade me to leave the country for a long time. During the entire trial, my friends kept telling me, “Let’s get you out,” “You can’t stay, they’ll put you in jail.” After they didn’t put me in jail, but only fined me, I thought, what else can I do? I can appeal. And I did, although that was also a risk, because the judge could ask for a more severe punishment for me. I understood this, but at the same time I also understood that if I didn’t appeal, then in the hypothetical future, which would come sooner or later, it would be harder for me to hold accountable those people who condemned me — my judge, investigators, FSB officers. I decided that I would do it anyway. By that time, I already understood that I really needed to leave, because I didn’t stop. Life changed a lot during the investigation and trial, I changed. I no longer found ways to stay in Russia. It was literally a matter of life and death. I am not saying that someone was going to destroy me physically, it is just that there was less and less desire to live inside. It was a very difficult period, it was a difficult decision, but I was preparing for it. My appeal court was on October 26, and on November 1 I was already in Kazakhstan. All my emigration adventures were so amazing and gentle only thanks to the people who love me and have known me for a long time. I believe that those people who left on their own initiative - today you are here, and tomorrow it is unknown where, it is unknown with whom, it is unknown what your job is, it is unknown at all - these are ascetics, because they left the country only based on a moral choice. I was taken out after all. My friends supported me very, very much, so after I left, I had the opportunity to come to my senses. I ended up here thanks to the Freedom House foundation.
You are a musician, do you have the opportunity to make music here?
— Some time ago, it was the biggest problem. I took all three of my instruments with me, I had a hard time transporting them across all the borders, but when I came here, I realized that I had no one to play with. I am an ensemble person, I really like playing with someone, because playing in an ensemble produces completely different music, not the same as when you are alone with yourself and the music. Playing with someone is a contact of different life streams. I really missed making music together, but just recently, maybe a month ago, my friend, whom I met here, took me by the hand to a music jam. Anyone could come there. I met guys from different countries, so now I have a little outlet. It's some kind of fantasy. At the last jam, an American, an Iranian, an Indian, a Belarusian and I played. It is always very lively, very free. This is the experience that I have been missing for a long time. In Tomsk, this happened, but it was more difficult, because Russian musicians are special people, like Russians in general. We have a long way to go to learn to be free and simply enjoy life, enjoy what we do, enjoy music, enjoy each other. And I'm not even talking about the fact that we have a path of transformation of our country and reconciliation ahead. The pleasure I'm talking about can be experienced right now, because it helps to live not sometime later, when the war ends, but now. I have such an opportunity.
Will the war last long?
— Oh, that’s a difficult question. It’s clear that the consequences will last for a long time, if humanity doesn’t destroy itself, then for 50 years, maybe more. While I’ve been living here, I’ve had different feelings. At first it seemed like it would last for a long time, but now for some reason it seems like it will end pretty soon. Maybe I just want it to end. Here I met people from Belarus and Ukraine, and from here the war looks completely different than from Tomsk. Oddly enough, in Tomsk the war was perceived more acutely, because there was a feeling that you couldn’t do anything at all to stop it. And here I talked to Ukrainians and realized that it’s very difficult, it’s practically impossible, you constantly feel guilty and ashamed, it prevents you from talking to people, living and interacting somehow, but it needs to be done. I saw how Lithuanians, Ukrainians, and Belarusians treat me as a Russian, and I realized that their first reaction is also very difficult. That is, it is difficult for everyone to accept each other as we are, it is difficult to accept the situation because our countries are at war, but nevertheless we are trying to do it. It can be said that through communication with people from different countries, I personally bring the end of the war closer. I want to believe in this and hope that the war will end as soon as possible. Killing each other does not require great intelligence.
What are you most afraid of?
— It’s simple — I’m afraid for my children. It’s hard to talk about. When the war started, I realized that my children’s future was simply destroyed. I’m very afraid that Russia will win. Not on the battlefield, although that’s also possible, but I don’t think that will happen, but in the sense that it will remain the way it is now. It’s very painful to understand that your country has no future. I want Russia to change radically. That’s probably my biggest fear.
What gives hope?
— I can say “God,” but that would be too general. Probably, communication with people gives me hope the most. If we don’t talk about some of my personal religious ideas, then life experience and some conclusions about myself also give hope. People can change, and God, some call it the Universe, is merciful. The world can be merciful towards a person, this is important. And the opportunity to meet, communicate, be yourself with completely different people also gives hope.
